Do Follow Lists And Their Demise
March 11, 2011
Welcome to the Google Places SEO blog at Tucson SEO Solutions.
Do Follow Lists And Their Demise
We launched this blog back in May of 2008. As a promotion and as a way to give back to the blogging community we immediately started working on our categorized lists of Do Follow Blogs. We would eventually grow these lists to around 320 blogs by July. By August we had added a Do Follow forums list that grew to 420 sites.
The forums list eventually got us pegged as spammers by a SEO forum owner. The owner of that forum had used some language in a comment that I had deemed inappropriate. I made the mistake of calling him out on this in an a personal email. This person had made several comments previously so I took the time to explain that his comments were appreciated but just not his language.
The guy responded buy calling me out on as forum as a spammer. Then almost in an instant there was a small group of blogger’s bashing me on their blogs and on various forums that I was using. It was an ugly week for me. It made no difference that the post which included the new list talked about adding valuable and not spamming. It was as if I were aiding and abetting the enemy.
In retrospect 2011, I can more clearly understand there position. Even though my intentions were pure I was providing spammers with easy access to Do Follow forums. Many, no make that most of these visitors ignored my pleas to leave valuable comment. They were using my sites information to spam these forums and blogs. Of course, not everyone was a spammer but enough were to create problems.
What amazed me most about these differences in opinions was that many of these attacks were personal. One forum moderator even published some of our whois information and called this sites owner out by name. Not only was that wrong it is dangerous behavior. And the person whose named was mentioned is not the person who authors the blog.
I tried to be reasonable with these people to no avail. I just finally choose to ignore them and things eventually quieted down. However, that forum thread bashing us still sends about 35 visitors a month here and its been almost a year. The bounce rate for this traffic is 100%. (over two years now)
Despite some bumps along the way we took a lot of pride in updating and maintaining our lists. They were a superior product compared to the mish-mash of lists that where available at the time and today. Actually, I have yet, to see another site that broke these sites by category. Soon it seemed like these lists were everywhere, but most of them were not of much help because they were not maintained and were full of no follow blogs.
Our lists were mentioned in over 50 blogs and forums and they generated up to 55% of our over all website traffic. However, only a very small fraction of these visitors ever left a comment that wasn’t spam. These visitors used the lists often to spread comment spam. No matter how often we pleaded to leave useful comments it just wasn’t happening.
By April of 2009 the blog list had shrunk to less than 90. Most of these blogs switched back to No Follow. Now, that I removed the lists from this site I am still getting lots of comments. Mostly still thanking me for the great lists that do not exist. anymore Recently, this story was used in an article by Aaron Wall of SEObook about something for nothing!
Aaron was making a point about offering things for free and he used my experience as an example. I never thought that I would ever be mentioned on his blog, let alone be an example mentioned in a post. But Aaron’s point is well taken. We both have experienced people ripping off our content for profit and these people are often the first to complain.
I was amazed to learn how many people rip off SEObooks content on a daily basis. This blog has received 16 trackbacks from blogs that stole his content from this one article. These blogs send out their trackbacks to all sources mentioned in the article. They then hope to get a link back from me. I have posted many of these trackbacks without a backlink to these sites and include an explanation of what is occurring.
The end result of this activity on this post is that it forces the post higher in the search rankings for Do Follow blogs. Its crazy that by removing the lists I get more useful comments then when the lists were available. It is really was upsetting that we had but so much effort into a project to have mindless selfish people destroy it.
I truly do regret that my lists may have had a negative impact on some blogs. What really pushed me over the edge was when a niche product marketer directed his clients to use my lists. He had the gall to comment that he encourage his clients to leave useful comments. The problem was they were not making comments. Their comment rate was .003%.
The other major problem was the huge amount of people that lied about their blogs status. I wasted 4 – 24 hour days (96 hours) over the last year visiting blogs to verify requests their Do Follow status only find that I had been deceived. Yes, that’s a whole bunch of bogus requests to get placed in my lists.
What these lists did was shed light onto the unsavory world of unethical link building. When Google forced the issue of buying and selling links in 2007 it only greased the wheels of comment spam and it didn’t need any encouragement. Since Google began playing hardball over the buying and selling of links it has become increasingly more difficult to obtain links. Rather than working longer hours to build links many website owners opted to take the low road called comment spam. There actions hurt us all.
The sad things is that the Do Follow lists were written up on many blogs. Yet, our ethical link building efforts have been mostly ignored by other blogger’s. Our original 109 Days of Links was especially ignored by those who got reviewed. Then there was that reddened faced man with the gray/white beard. He didn’t like his review and he has been waging a comment war ever since.
Update: 06/04/2008
Since I wrote this post I have heard from several individuals who claim to have purchased the program, Niche Blueprint. They all claim that they were directed to add value through useful content. So I will give them credit for that. But people in these programs want the most amount of action is the least amount of work. They are not motivated to leave a non spammy comment.
I freely admit that I did not appreciate fully the importance of comment quality until I became a blog owner. There were a few short comments along the way late at night when I was tired. These were the exception, as I like to share my wisdom, but I myself am not without stain here.
What I decided to do was encourage what I call Scratch My Back Marketing that focuses on leaving a quality comment in exchange for links. That’s what the 109 Day Link Building Program was all about. It emphasizes networking and branding while link building. This program focuses on the long term strategy rather than short term gain.
I hoped to create a core group of blog owner and social networking sites that believe as I do. If you have a Do Follow blog that is updated regularly with original content or a social networking site please contact me for further details. This site is scheduled to go live on or about September 15th. The 109 Day Link Building Explosion will morph into the 120 Day Link Building Explosion. It will appear on a membership site that will be free for blogger’s that have an active Do Follow blog with comments. (closed)
What say you?
Our Arizona Services:
If your business is located in the communities of Tucson, Yuma, Flagstaff, Tempe, Mesa , Arizona or beyond and you need Google Places SEO solutions please call Tucson SEO at 520-505-6024 Now!
Tucson SEO… Solutions that create probabilities out of possibilities.
Comments
24 Responses to “Do Follow Lists And Their Demise”
As you know, I’ve been watching, reading, and following your blog for several months now. I’ve noticed that you get very upset by some of the actions and comments of other bloggers. You often refer to them as attacks. If you change your focus and/or discontinue some of the programs that you have worked on I hope you do so from a thought out business perspective and not bad feelings.
Sticks and stones mate. You have been straightforward from the get go. Your intentions are clear and always have been honorable. Don’t waste your time trying to make everyone see the light. Let that crap roll off your back and keep up the good work.
DS fly fishing equipment reviews’s last blog post..The Adult Elk Hair Caddis Dry Fly
While I mostly agree with you, I must deal with the fact that others stole the life out of a project. It is easy to say move on if it wasn’t your program that was destroyed in the process. You might be signing a different tune if you were in my shoes. If you had put in over a 1,000 into a project you might be bummed out as well.
There is a better way, that I call Scratch MY Back Marketing, and I am going to promote that. I may not change the world but if a few see the light then it is worth it to me.
Hi, Great post! I felt great reading your blog post. I’m working with my friend in a small internet marketing business as a web developer. When I’m free I go around for some IT info
Admin: Jeff, you had me fooled here. I thought this was a legitimate comment until you used it twice on two different posts!
Ok I tell the truth. When I search for do follow blog I got this website. By the way I dont understand this ->> “Spammer” What is that.
How ever thank for allowing us to put comments.
I think it would depend on what the blog is about and what information is provided. Spamming is just flat out advertising without providing any relevant information. There are ton of No Follow blogs out there but the best thing to do is just monitor the comments if that is a huge issue but if a blogger goes on other blogs and links and comments and then get’s upset when that blogger does the same on theirs, that is pure hypocrisy. I think that is what makes a lot of people upset OR if the link would take away business from the blog if they are selling something that is also what gets people upset.
Jack,
Try adding the Bad behavior plugin. It will eliminate the bot comments.
There is nothing wrong with posting a list of dofollow forums and blogs. If these forum and blog owners get upset, it is their own fault. It’s not like you, the person that posted the lists, made all the comments.
Admin: That kind of reasoning would never hold up in a court of law. While my intentions were good the net result was bad. Case closed!
Spammers took advantage. No one can really blame them because that’s what they do, if you know what I mean; that is, spam and blatantly advertise whatever they need to advertise and as blog/forum admin it will really get on your nerves. Too bad you had to be the person to post the list. As you said, the intentions are good but turned out really bad for the blog and forum owners.
Anyways, thanks for dropping by my site and for the heads up, appreciated it.
The reality is that Google is responsible for this nonsense. Frankly, I liked the web better in 1999. The hypocrisy of Google lashing out against paid links while it makes it revenue off Ad words is mind-blowing.
I’m sick of going to sites that are are text heavy because they’re trying to rank in Google. I can’t imagine the amount of man hours wasted building B.S. content for the search engines. Even simple city pages in the yellow pages have full city description. It’s ridiculous.
Dave
Dave’s last blog post..8 Traits of Highly Successful Chauffeurs
Hi Dave,
An FYI here: You don’t need bunches of words in your content to rank well in Google. In fact your targeted keyword phrases need only appear two or three times on your page. This piece of advice was provided by Mr Matts Cutts and was reported in USA today back around June of 08.
Look up Silicon Valley SEO in Google and check out the number 1 result. http://www.siliconvalletseo.com. It has four words of content! It reads SEO for start-ups and that’s it.
I get your point, but to be fair, “silicon valley seo” is pretty uncompetitive.
I realize you don’t need a lot of content but Mr. Cutts has been preaching “content is king” for years and the seo community has followed. As a result, the web is full of pages built around such fascinating phrases as “pool cleaning in Tuscon Arizona.” You have to admit it’s slightly ridiculous.
Google has improved significantly since the Florida Update, but for every problem it solves, another is created. I think it’s time for a paradigm shift.
Anyway, thanks for the response. I’ll be investigating the rest of your site with interest.
Sincerely
Dave
Dave’s last blog post..Long Live The Built-In Gratuity
If you have a pool cleaning business in Tucson you will want to be found for “pool cleaning Tucson. It would not do you any good to rank outside your market.
We are ranked #1 and # 2 for Tucson SEO and their may not be a huge number of searches for this query. However, we do SEO in Tucson so it doesn’t matter. We catch everyone in our market.
We also rank on the first page of Google for a dozen or so other searches nationally. We create content that matches the targeted keyword phrase. It is easy to make the search engines happy it is much more difficult to please the visitor.
I agree with Dave.
Google are their own worst enemy (or ours). The web is the new frontier for making money and if Google continue to put their finger in the dyke to plug a leak that doesn’t suit them, they are going to run out of fingers real soon.
You cant stop greed. Some guy 2000 years ago tried, and look what happened to him!
Still they will try, and the rest of us will just have to find a work-around
It really sucks that the lists were bombarded by spammers. The only thing I don’t like about running do follow blogs is the amount of spam. I to have been banned by certain forums that will remain namless due to my inability to keep my mouth shut when speaking with the moderators.
Kris’s last blog post..Top 5 Webmaster Forums
I also have a list of dofollow blogs and directories on my blog. I’ve linked to it above. I’ve had my list posted for a year and change it after each Page rank update.
I also encourage my readers to comment responsibly and not to spam, but I can’t control them. No matter what comes along to benefit everybody, some people will take advantage of it and spoil it for everybody else. I don’t think that’s their intent. They just want the results without doing the work.
I do get criticized by some bloggers, usually those who tried dofollow and quit because of spam. (Yes it’s a bit more trouble to delete the spam, but spam filters do most of it.)
I actually like the controversy around dofollow vs. nofollow. It exemplifies the intensity of emotions involved, and demonstrates some of the problems with the present blogging community and Page rank system.
I have no plans to delete my list. Attacks on it and the dofollow trend don’t discourage me. But I do delete any blogs not wanting to be on my list, and add those requesting to be added with every Page Rank update.
Linda P. Morton’s last blog post..The Changing Role Of Human Resources = Diversity
I’m so sorry that you experienced this kind of emotional turmoil, particularly as you were so well-intentioned to provide the list.
After reading the possible repercussions that can happen to sites that are on such lists, do you recommend that webmasters forgo inclusion?
For example, there are “do follow” directories and search engines that seem to enjoy relative high traffic and visibility. Do you think it is a mistake to list one’s blog on such sites?
I welcome any feedback.
Admin: If I were doing things all over I would not want to be on these lists. I would add Bad Behavior plugin to catch bot spam. I would then add Comment Luv and promote that.
Thanks so much for timely response! I will look into adding the tools that you recommend.
Sheepishly, I have to admit that I’ve never heard of the “Bad Behavior” pluin or “Comment Luv” before reading your blog. Thanks for serving as such an important bearer of information.
Honestly, some of your posts are among the most useful ones I have found online. When I entered the Internet marketing field (which is not long ago) I had no idea where to begin with. Then I heard about how great do-follow blogs are, and how easy you can get external links for your site, but all that info came from one year-old posts. Now I figured out why there are no follow blogs in old lists of do follow ones and how I can work my way around this whole complex area. I’m just a beginner, but I hope I wont mess things up (too much anyway). So thanks, I bookmarked this page, and I’ll definitely check back.
I have been following your site for almost 9 months and have watched you deal with spammers, and contributed to the discussion where I could. I even installed a great spam tool you recommended on one of my blogs. In short, I value your opinion and do the “scratch your back ” whenever I can. Like you said, it is sad that so many have taken the spam road.
However, I have one observation/theory. You have mentioned that many of the blogs you listed have turned to “no-follow”. However, I do NOT think it had any thing to do with you. I submit that it is possible those blogs you mentioned may not know they have gone no-follow, especially if they are using any WP based blogging software.
A few “upgrades” back, WP made all upgrade installations no-follow by default. Unless you were actively looking and inspecting (how many blog owners actually read release notes?), you would not know your blog has just gone no-follow.
To take that even further, the latest upgrade from WP makes your blog “no-index”. So Google and other SE’s would drop you like a rock unless you actively inspect your new upgrade installation. Plus you have to really search to find out how to change it. Unless you are VERY familiar with code, the no-follow status has to be changed with a plugin.
Obviously this no-index and no-follow affects ad revenue that any WP blogger receives. Spammers or not, some of them do click on ads.
Don’t you think that is more plausible a reason for the blogs you listed returning to no-follow than blaming yourself?
Thanks,
Bill
Admin: Bill, First things first. Great comment put you used only keywords in the name field. That’s why I use Keyword Luv. When you do that you look like a spammer yourself. However, you are not and I know that, but I don’t provide links if you only use keywords.
Now, back to your point. Yes, you make valid points but I played a role in helping spammers and I regret that. That is one reason why I created the new anti spam plugin that I call Scratch My Back Marketing. It prevents those short drive bye comments.
Yes, I provided them with tools. Put I have learned to turn lemons into lemonade. I will be launching my Do Follow network site where we will provide Do Follow resources but with accountability built into the program.
Whatever I or others do, spam is here and its not going away so you just have to accept it and protect yourself. If you want to get ride of the auto bot spam you need to install the Tan Tan Noodles. I did and I now don’t get any auto bot spam. I was averaging 350 a day! WordPress is very slow to pick up banned sites, but eventually it does work. The only spam in Akismet these days is from banned commenters.
The Scratch My Back Marketing plugin will be released in a couple of weeks. It will stop the short drive by comments. However, eventually these spammers will just copy and paste longer comments to get around this as well. I recently spent a few hours on a Black Hat forum to see what they are up to and it was an eye opening event for me.
Thanks for sharing.
My Apologies on the name thing. I freely admit, I forgot to syntax it properly (was a long day). Thanks for the gentle reminder. I did not even put my site link in this time just so you know I am not doing this in an effort to get a link.
TanTan is the plugin I mentioned that I got from you, even gave you guys a shout out on it. And yeah, I still get drive-bys too, but no where near what I used to get. To be honest, you are far nicer than I am. On comments that are obvious spam, I change their anchor text to “spam”, then approve it.
I still contend that you are giving yourself WAY too much grief over this. Unscrupulous people, out for a quick buck, took advantage of a good faith offering. That happens in just about everything: internet, politics, government, I could go on and on. But to take so much blame for that is just, well… not accurate.
Let me put a bug in your ear. How about doing an article, poll, or series on “Did you know your blog is no-follow?” I truly believe you will be surprised at the number of people that have no idea their blog (WP or not) is a no-follow blog. Would be a great lead in for Scratch My Back wouldn’t it?
Thanks,
Bill
I have been doing some research because I am thinking about starting a niche SEO business and found your site. Unfortunately, I know your pain. I too in a SEO forum got pegged as a spammer only because I gave a glowing review on SEO software I use. I had to prove I was not or be banned. Its a little out of hand.
I like your concept of scratch my back marketing. Spammers are parasites and they take and give nothing in return. I agree with Bill. You gave a good faith offering and people exploited it. I wouldn’t let others direct your motivation. And the blame directed at you truly is not accurate.
I know this really sounds spammy but I like your site and learning more about your organization.
Regards,
Brendan
I have recently been thinking about how to add commenting to my own site. Now I have a few more things to think about. I use Joomla not WP so I’ll have to take a look around for appropriate spam filters.
So, are you going to try to sell your new spam filter plug-in for others to use?
.-= Caig Scott – website writing´s last blog ..Auditing Your Website’s Internal Links – Part 2 =-.
Admin: It will be released for free! I want to make spammers lives more difficult.
Thanks for sharing info. Coupon codes are great way to save money online. It is incredible that with just a click we can find number of products that have coupons. It saves time and money.
Admin: Comment does not pass our Comment Policy Guidelines
I use the SEObook firefox plugin. It’s actually really convenient. They have a lot of good documentation too on their site. It’s unfortunate that people feel the need to steal and can’t come up with something original.